The New Gestapo is here!

[IM]

September 11 and it's after math has created a new and alarming trend in this nation. And it's now high time that we all begin to recognize just exactly what is happening here.

During the Clinton era, many of you people regardless of whether you were republican or liberarian were busy proclaiming hpow Hitler-like Clinton was. Oh he was for promoting gun limitations, so the comparison to Hitler was made using the excuse that Hitler took away the peoples weapons as a beginning of taking away their freedom.

Now today, you have a president in office who has established a new agency, one that does not answer to the American people. He appointed his buddy, former Governor Tom Ridge, the Pennsylvania executioner, to be in charge of this agency. Ridge is travelling from state to state creating secret policies under the guise of protecting us from terrorist attacks.

And like the lemmings most of you have been, you accept this because as long as you have a right wing idiot in charge you think that you will get all your advantages back, just like in the so-called good old days.

Yes, I am talking about the newly created office of Homeland security. this office is complete with an appointed, not elected, Director. J. Edgar Hoover was appointed to lead the FBI some 70 years ago, and during his reign, he made ALL decisions on who was unAmerican and who should be stopped from excersizing their constitutional right to free speech and destroyed any semblance of peaceful assembly with his use of force, sometimes deadly, in circumstances which deadly force was not necessary.

Now we have Mr. Ridge. He and Bush are meeting secretly to determine how to stop "terrorist" activities from seeping into this nation. However, what seems to be forgotten by many is that terrorism has existed here long before Osama Bin Laden was a gleam in his daddy's eye.

The creation of this office should be scrutinized by every American citizen. I mean we have a VP who refuses to give information to congress relative to Enron, yet when Clinton did this every single one of you claimed he was stonewalling. we have a president who is creating departments and appoiinting friends to these offcies and they do not have to answer to congress or us about their activities.

This man can act independantly, all he has to say is that anyone he detains is a terrorist and that will be the end ofit. Most of you will blindly believe this, because after all, this man must be more honest than Slick Willy. Yet when it was time for our President to answer up about his cocaine use, he refused to even make say he did not enhale. Rather he decided that he should not have to answer questions about his past, yet he demanded that his opponent answer questions not only about his past behavior, but the behavior of another independant grown man.

The new gestapo is here folks, and even by writng this, I am at risk of being placed on the Mad inquisitors terrorist list. By what I am doing is exactly what I am allowed to do by the constitution of this nation, that is freely speak, and peacefully complain. The events of 9-11 did not change my rights as a human being.

So for all you right wing supporters, and conservatives or Libertarian anti government complainers, government just got even more intrusive. And now there is nothing you can do about it. This man canot be kicked out of office, he must be fired by his buddy, the Texas Executioner. The man who is President even though he lost the election, a man who is doing what ever he pleases, even though the entire world is telling him that he must now stop the bombing, a man who is taking our freedoms away from us daily under the guise of stopping terrorism, the man who said that he believes in God and follows the word of Jesus Christ, but cannot love his enemy or turn the other cheek.

It's time that we really begin to think about just who YOU voted for, because I did not vote for this idiot.

[Lance]

IM: I don't disagree with you at all. This is dangerous as hell. And I didn't vote for him either.

[Ed Edwards]

Somehow i got the impression in the Gore/Bush election
that is was the Antichirst being elected. Sorry, i
don't buy it. Well, maybe it was just the crowd
that i run with felt this way?

My wedding in Jan is pictured here:
http://eded.tripod.com/wed1.html

[LibertyNutcase]

IM,

I agree with you on the Errosion of Freedoms and we need to stand up and scream STOP! How many letters and/or emails have you written to the clowns in DC?

Here's some <A HREF="http://www.nrahq.org/transcripts/cpac0202.asp">Food for Thought</A> from a very unlikely source that would go against Bush.

But under an Al Gore regime, do you really think that they would have done better? C'mon! The first thing HE would have done is ban all privately owned fire-arms and sent the BATF to kick in the door of every person who even hinted of being Pro Gun as a Would be terrorist?

Under his mentor's reign: We got to see the INS (Immigration and Naturalization Services) kick in the door of unarmed private citizens to liberate Elian and send him back to Cuba to die.

As far as being legitimate, the recount was completed and Bush actually won by bigger numbers. He is legitimate. <B>Al Gore lost, Get over it!</B> (This is A LA Clintonista Supporters with a twist.)

Since we are on the previous Election, there was so much misinformation in the National Media about what was going on down here!!

The most prominent thing that they lied about is the financial disposition of the Four Counties that the recounts were conducted in.

FACT: The Recounts were conducted in the County's that Gore carried by 70% or better.

FACT: Under Florida Law, the only time a candidate can request a recount is in a county that HE LOST by LESS THAN 1%

LIE: The counties that the recounts were in were the poorest in the State and Couldn't afford newer equipment. (ABC, CBS, NBC, CNN, AP)

FACT: Of the Four Counties, Volusia is the Second Poorest but have the highly accurate optical scanning equipment. I know personally cause I live in Volusia Co.

FACT: Dade and Palm Beach County are among the Richest (#3 and #1) in the State and their voters continually refused to raise the sales tax temporarily to upgrade their voting equipment. We in Volusia Co. already paid for ours and now with the reforms in the Voting Laws because of Al Gore's Tempertantrum, We have to kick in for entire State Upgrade (But we won't be getting anything, Thanks Al.)

FACT: Broward County had the highest number of Reform Party Registered Voters. In fact there are twice as many as the number of Votes the Buchannon got in this "Predominantly Jewish" County.

FACT: The Jewish People don't all vote identically, no matter what the Mainstream Media says. I'm sorry Peter Jennings, Ted Koppel, Bernard Shaw, etc., the Facts are the Facts no matter how much SPIN you apply.

FACT: 7 out of 9 US Supreme Court Justices agreed that the Recount Process was Unconstitutional. Even though subsequent votes were political posturing.

FACT: If Al Gore had carried his own home State, Florida would not have even been a footnote in the Election. Ever stop and wonder why TN's favorite Conservative Senator fell out of favor?

FACT: People ARE Stupid. Two voters in front of me had the Optical Scanner kick their ballots out for Over Voting. Read carefully :<I><B>Color in ONE CIRCLE only for your Choice for the Office of . . .</I></B> I think the infamous Butterfly Ballot (Which was rather Common place, they have them in Harford Co., MD where I used to vote) would have really kicked their ass.

dB-)LNC

[LibertyNutcase]

Oh Rats! I am so used to using REAL code.

[IM]

Liberty,

I think that when you say that Bush won in bigger numbers you are only referring to Florida. That was the state which was in question, and that was the state which allowed him to win the electoral vote. However, he did not win the popular vote. The popular vote in a democracy shows the will of the people, the electoral college takes the will of the people away. And that is because Alex Hamilton and others did not believe that the general public had enough sense to vote for someone, so then in the end, the rich and powerful would end up making the decision for them.

So when I say that Bush did not win the election, he did not win the popular vote, and it was the Supreme court that put him in office. So when we talk about this election, it is you who should realize the FACT that G.W. lost.

And I tend to agree with you on Gore, although the Elian Gonzalez mess happened because the people in Miami wanted to separate this boy from the only parent he had left alive. All republicans were for this separation, yet they are the people who always were spewing out the family values bullshit. The boy wanted to go back to his father, that was the choice he made. In fact, by the laws of this nation, a child would go back to the only surviving parent in any situation like Elian Gonzales'. The Cubans in Miami tried using this little boy as a political pawn against Castro. So when one talks about Elian Gonzales the INS and their entry into the home, that is something we also should consider.

Finally, I think that when we talk about "spin" we should remember that the right side has put out just as much spin as anyone else. It is our job to decipher the spin and find out the truth. It does not matter if Gore did not win his home state, he won the popular vote, and that Liberty, should be the final determiner of a winner when it comes to picking leaders in a system that claims it is by and for the people .

8)

P.S. I work on a job where I can talk with policymakers, not only in my state, but our senators and congressmen. Therefore they have heard from me.

[LibertyNutcase]

IM,

First off, we are a Republic not a Democracy. A Republic is where the People choose someone to represent them in the decision making process; whereas in a Democracy each and every person votes and decides on each and every issue.

This is not a matter of wording semantics, but a very real and exteremely important difference. If your job, as you say, allows you to interact with your duly elected representatives, then I'm sure that you are quite aware of that.

Secondly Alexander Hamilton wanted a President for Life (an elected Monarch of sorts). It was George Mason of VA that brought up the Electoral College. Mason stated emphatically that the voters could not make an intelligent choice because they would not be familiar with the character and talent of the candidates. It would resemble, he declared, a blind man trying to select colors.

Albeit, Albert Gore, Jr. did win the Popular Vote by more than 500,000 (50,996,000) over George W. Bush (50,456,000), which was a margin of 0.5%. However, he lost the all important deciding Electoral College 266-271, respectively.

Mr. Gore is not the first lose in this manner:

*In 1876, Rutherford B. Hayes (elected the 19th president) won the election over Samuel J Tindel by 1 electoral vote, but he had 250 thousand less overall votes or 3 percent of the vote at the time.

*In 1888, Benjamin Harrison (elected the 23rd president) won the election over Grover Cleveland (the 22nd president and elected the 24th president next election) by 65 electoral votes but lost the epopular vote by 90,000.


So to tie all of this together, in this Constitutional Republic, we the people select representatives for our respective States to select a President on our behalf. It was the Constitution, the Supreme Law of these United States, that Decided who became President, not the Supreme Court. This is how We the People Elect the single most Powerful Person in the Country. It is a time tested and proven method that has endured for more than 210 years. I, and many Americans, still have much more faith in Our Founding Fathers than the multitude of the afore-mentioned over-voters.

So, My Dear Friend IM, the FACT is: Tennessee DID count and was of greater importance than any Gore Supporter is willing to admit. Gore may be a breadth's hair more popular than Bush, but He Lost the Election. It is that Plain and simple.

In Liberty,

dB-) LNC

A post on Elian coming soon to a Board near you.

[attachment deleted by admin]

[LibertyNutcase]

IM,

First off, we are a Republic not a Democracy. A Republic is where the People choose someone to represent them in the decision making process; whereas in a Democracy each and every person votes and decides on each and every issue.

This is not a matter of wording semantics, but a very real and exteremely important difference. If your job, as you say, allows you to interact with your duly elected representatives, then I'm sure that you are quite aware of that.

Secondly Alexander Hamilton wanted a President for Life (an elected Monarch of sorts). It was George Mason of VA that brought up the Electoral College. Mason stated emphatically that the voters could not make an intelligent choice because they would not be familiar with the character and talent of the candidates. It would resemble, he declared, a blind man trying to select colors.

Albeit, Albert Gore, Jr. did win the Popular Vote by more than 500,000 (50,996,000) over George W. Bush (50,456,000), which was a margin of 0.5%. However, he lost the all important deciding Electoral College 266-271, respectively.

Mr. Gore is not the first lose in this manner:

- In 1876, Rutherford B. Hayes (elected the 19th president) won the election over Samuel J Tindel by 1 electoral vote, but he had 250 thousand less overall votes or 3 percent of the vote at the time.

- In 1888, Benjamin Harrison (elected the 23rd president) won the election over Grover Cleveland (the 22nd president and elected the 24th president next election) by 65 electoral votes but lost the epopular vote by 90,000.

So to tie all of this together, in this Constitutional Republic, We the People select representatives for our respective States to select a President on our behalf. It was the Constitution, the Supreme Law of these United States, that Decided who became President, not the Supreme Court. This is how We the People Elect the single most Powerful Person in the Country. It is a time tested and proven method that has endured for more than 210 years. I, and many Americans, still have much more faith in Our Founding Fathers than the multitude of the afore-mentioned over-voters.

So, My Dear Friend IM, the FACT is: Tennessee DID count and was of greater importance than any Gore Supporter is willing to admit. Gore may be a breadth's hair (less than a half of a percent) more popular than Bush, but He Lost the Election. It is that Plain and simple.

In Liberty,

dB-) LNC

A post on Elian coming soon to a Board near you.

[Lance]

:o Jeremy: That old "Bush Country" map really doesn't prove a lot. We don't elect presidents by the square miles they won.

Should Kansas count equally with NYC? Somehow...I don't think so. "W" won all the rural conservative areas, but Gore won all the big metro areas. That is why the election was so close.

It looks nice and it trys to portrait that "W" has a mandate...but in reality you've got the hair of the ass winner in a nearly 50-50 election.

Now...I'm NOT saying Gore would be better. In fact, I was debating in this election to vote AGAINST Gore by voting for "W" as I thought Al would be the way wrong choice for the country. I also think "W" is a barely better 2nd wrong choice. In the end, I decided principle should matter and if it took 4 years of a Gore administration to convince the people of the error of their ways...so be it. I voted for Harry Browne.

[IM]

Nutcase

I'm not going to argue with you on what happened to Gonzales, because you live in Florida. Obviously, you probably got more than enough of you share of hearing the story from all sides. I don't doubt what you say is true. However could you break up what you posted for easier reading please?

Secondly I really trust none of the corporate slaves, and that included Clinton. I know that he cheated on his wife, and a man who does that is simply wrong. My argument during that whole mess was that the republicans who cried the loudest cheated just as much, therefore they were hypocrites. And that is the truth regardless of how anyone likes to hear it.

Then when you talk of the race card and all that, I think that since you are not black, you really want to ignore the FACT that we are not equally treated. We have gone over that time and time again, so I think that we shall not continue with that argument. Whites like yourself want to think everything is fine simply because YOU may not be a racist. However racists do exist, and racists exist who control the ability for people to get hired, advance and even enter school. So if you think that the race card is some mystical thing that so-called liberals make up whenever they are caught in a lie, well, I just don't feel like arguing about it anymore. You'll just have to live through the demise of this nation to understand that because we have wasted human resources, this nation has never reached it's true potential. And we never will as long as there are people like you who think that there is such a thing as the race card that people play on their conveneice to get over.

I know that we are a republic and by your definition, this means that the people elect someone to represent them. Well Gore won the popular vote of THE PEOPLE. However Bush won the elitist vote which Hamilton,(oops George Mason if you say so) created by forming the electoral college. The electoral college destroys the will of the people, by creating another layer of representation after the people have voted. It should be abolished, and I have said this for years. Even in college in my political philosphy courses, much to the lowering of my grades even.

I voted for Nader, and not Gore. So when I am talking about this last election, I am saying that GW won, but he was put in by a conservative supreme court. The will of the people did not count, and it will never truly ever count until we get rid of the electoral college. It does not matter how many people lost before Gore, it was as wrong then as it was in 2000.

As I watched the debates, I felt that Gore was better prepared to be president than Bush, but I refuse to continue voting for corporate slaves. Gore had process driven answers. Bushs answers were mostly ideological, and that does not get it when a persn asks, as G.W. was asked on several occasions HOW would he do a certain thing. Not WHY, but HOW. And so now we have a man who stands in front of us talking tough, but he too was able to avoid Vietnam because he was one of the fortunate ones. (Creedence Clearwater Revival anyone?)

Now he stands up and wants to kill every one he thinks is a terrorist, when Ameirca has comitted acts of teror which have been responsible for more dead thatn the 3-4,000 on 9-11. And I include Willy C, in these acts of terror just as much as anyone else.

8)

[The Guardian]

;D This topic is now FIXED!

[LibertyNutcase]

IM,

The Elian Gonzalez post wasn't mine, but Jeremy's. Also, I made no reference to race nor the race card, again, that was Jeremy.

8) LNC

[IM]

The "race card" is a term made up by conservatives which is used to keep white boys like Jeremy from seeing the truth.

Now you can continue screaming about some fictional card if you want to, and quite frankly I have argued enough about racism in this forum. I am tired of arguing with people who want to ignore the truth so that they can maintain the system which onl;y provides preferences for peopl e looking like them.

So what you need to understand Jeremy, is that the same people who made up the fictional race card will make up the poor card, or the long haired hippie card, or the terrorist card also.

Any means necessary to keep us divided so that they can continue robbing us blind.

You had better start looking at the real people whoi want to take away our rights. None of them are liberals fool!

Who wants to take away the choice of abortion?

Who wants to take away the choice to pray or not to pray in schools?

Who wants to take away the choice to choose ones partner?

Who wants to take away the choice of how we worship God?

Who wants to take away the ability to celebrate the different cultures in America?

Who wants to take away our right to peacefully air our grievances against thie government, under the guise of anti-terrorism?

Who wants to take away the opportubnity for people in need to get help when they need it, not just for 2 stright yeasrs, and only 5 years in a life time?

All of these were things CONSERVATIVES have been wanting to take away. Yet you will ignore these things, and will fall into line with them while they bash liberals with lies and spin.

There is no such thing as the race card jeremy. Racism is real, and racists are out there trying to take away MY right to live here. And as long as this is true, I will be one bad m-f fighting against it until it dies. You can stand on the sidelines crying about how the I am cheating if you want to, but I am playing by the rules, and it just happens to be that me, and others like me have practiced a little harder and have been forced to scrimmage under game like coinditions to prepare ourselves for this battle. WE have scouted the enemy, and we know what plays they run before they line up in formation. They have been running the same offense for more than 200 years.

You on the other hand want to try defending against that offense using the same defensive alignment that has always been tried against it and has never worked. Crying about a mythical race card is one of the defensive formations.

Touchdown I.M. !!!!

[IM]

I've been telling you the truth since I first posted. There is no suh thing as the race card, and I'm not pre occupied with race. It's just a fact that racism is a problem in this nation. It will continue to be a problem until people like you recognize that it is and move to change.

I have never said YOU or any other white person is keeping me down. You see that is the problem, white people like you want to get defensive, they want to start taking it personal, when the reality is that what I am talking about is a system that has been traditionally based upon providing preferences for white males.

And if you could read, I have even broken that down to wealthy white males. After all that is who were initially granted rights in the constitution. There was no fredopm for all, only property owning white males.

OBTW, I might have a great job, but I am really not making a lot of money. But making money has not really been the objective for me. I like the job because I can fight for people who keep getting picked on by the wealthy, and I can call conservative politicians out on their campign promises.

Now let me tell you about the tewrm race card. WHat do we call the card that has been used for over 200 years that allowed whites to get away with murder in the court rooms? I mean whites got away with killing people, even admitting that they did so in some cases, and yet they never were convcted. What do we call the card that has been used for more than 200 years that had blacks killed for even just looking at a white person or not crossing the street when a white person walked on the side walk.

Oh but how we forget about such things until O.J. Simpson comes along. You don't know and I don't know if O.J. did it. BUt one thing you think you know is what the race card is. And since you defined it, then we must now understand that white boys have used the "race card" far more than any black person has ever thought about doing.

You are just stupid Jeremy. You know that the one percent of the most wealthy in this nation are robbing ALL of us, regardless of the color of our skin. BUt they will make up terms like "race card" so that people like you who think they are entitled to something because they are white can get mad at people of color who they think have more than them.

You have provided several examples of this in your last post .

I don't have to be tapped on my back so to speak to see the truth. Again all one has to do is look at the platforms of each party. We see that the republican party has been fighting over ideology for the past several years. We see that there have been sefveral "litmus tests" But of course you stay blind to the fact that since the right wing runs the republican party now, their agenda is to eliminate rights that they feel are not "christian".

But that's fine with you because you are still arguing over whether or not the King James version of the bible is written by satan worshippers.

And then you don't think that you have fallen for the conservative spin, so you ask me a question about who wants to keep the poor dependant upon the government and without ambition. That is classic conservative spin.

There are very few Americans of any race, or socioeconomic background who are without ambition. Secondly, the majority of people who are dependant upon government are white people. The most dependant people upon government money are corporations, not poor whites, blacks, or hispanics. So then who wants to insure that corporations can get as much money as they want too, without regulating thier activities?

CONSERVATIVES!!!!!

And we know why CLinton signed the bill. He still said that it was not well thought out and should be revisited. He didn't revisit it. And today the fallout from this bill is that there are more homeless on the streets, more children and poor needing services from nfp's, and the nfp' shave less resources to provide the services needed.

Yep, and this was forced through by a republican congress lead by far right conservatives.

You know Jeremy, I don't really give a good goobly damn whether or not YOU believe me when I say that racism is real and racists exists. You live in a dream world to begin with.

You say that you are starting a home based business but are getting the shaft. Well I hate to tell you, but when you start a business, you have to earn the trust of the customer. Whatever business you are in, you are competing against already established businesses, and you must have the marketing skill to make people take notice of your business.

I don't need to get attention by talking about race, the conversation has been going on in this nation since the beginning. Last night I held a fundraiser, and ate dinner with our state' s Senate Majority Leader. What did you do?


Get a clue or pick a better country? Like I said, you are using the same defense which has not worked for over 200 years. You are tired of hearing it? Well you will hear it until you change. You call me a loser, but I have raised a business from scratch to international recognition in about 2.5 years. And today, I am working to develop resources in another organization, and we have grown. You sit on your ass complaining about how you are getting screwed in your home business. Now when one compares things, the loser is you.

I.M. recovers the fumble and runs it in for another :

TOUCHDOWN!

[IM]

8)

That's funny. You wouldn't know the truth if someone slapped you in the face with it, idiot.


This statement coming from a person who believes that aliens came down to earth and created humans or something like that, then wants to argue with somebody like Ed about how the King James version of the bible is Satanic. Oh yeah Jeremy has all the answers.

Don't make me call you a liar and prove it, IM.


I think that I created this section in reference to the New Gestapo. This has nothing to do with race, and everything to do with the so-called Homeland Security agency and conservative republicans creating another way to take away our freedom. Only you keep bringing in the so-called race card. So Jeremy you just go ahead and try making me into a liar.

I think I can prove otherwise: am tired of arguing with people who want to ignore the truth so that they can maintain the system which onl;y provides preferences for peopl e looking like them.


Let's see where in this statement do I say, Jeremy is keeping me down? Now if you had enough intelligence, you would see that I am trying to get you to understand that when you talk about race based preferences, you and others like you only think that blacks gety them. But when the mirror is placed in front of your face, and we see that the majority of preferences have gone to white men, then you want to use the Forrest Gump technique and start calling people names and shit.

While I have been denied better paying jobs because of my race, I just keep fighting and fighting until I get a job which I am qualified for. Before I got this "professional" job, I worked at Wendy's slangin hamburgers. I also started a web site and desktop publishing business out of my home. I still do the web site design business also along with this job. And this is why I laugh at your whining about starting home based businesses and getting screwed every time you start one. I am not making a lot of money yet at designing web sites either, but I will keep going with this business. You onthe other hand probably have starteed a business and then since it did not get you money fast enough, ventured off into another business, and then wonder why customers are scarce.


Does the word stability ring a bell?

No, the problem is you can't read, nor do you understand any of the crap you type.


HA! HA! HA! HA! HA! HA! HA! HA! Some things just aren't worth replying to.

You see, you just don't understand. The top one percent are those who busted their ass to get where they are. If you wanna blame rich people for keeping you down then blame the rich 1% liberal bastards who didn't earn their money, but inherited it.


Well I think that Your conservative president is rich and he certainly did not work his ass off to earn anything. Secondly most of those who tell the great I worked hard to get mine lie, employed people to do all the hard work for them. Therefore the real people who have made things happen is the workers, who often get the shaft. Enron is a good example of what I am talking about. Kenneth Lay did not work his ass off by himself to make Enron a world energy power. Enron had thousands of employees at various levels who worked hard to make that company great. Yet each one of them got fuckeed, and Kenneth Lay and friends got rich.

THe same thing happened with Micheal Milken and Ivan Boesky, although their theft may have been even more henous because they did not know the people they robbed, nor did they care about robbing them. And these people did not work their asses off to get rich, they got insider information, which is against all trading law, and they used it to get rich.

You want to sit on your ass believing the if you work hard enough lie, but that lie ended in the early 1900's. Now if 100 people start a business today, only 1 will get rich. This is what I call the one percent dream. And there is not contest where anyone will argue that if you have a one percent chance, you have an outstanding opportunity to win.

Only here with people like you, is this argument used with a belief that it is actually the truth. And when 1 percent of the people control 98 percent of the wealth, you discover that there is a lot of inherited money in it regardless of whether they are liberal, conservative, libertarian, socialist, etc.

Now here's agood example of the kettle calling the pot black. Learn to read, idiot!


I know what I'm talking about. For years I have shown you proof with numbers, yet you and only a couple of others have consistently denied that what is presented in your face is true. So, when it comes to learning how to read, or learning what the truth is, you need to go back to Devry.

Another shinning example of the kettle and pot analogy. Dude, you really don't see how brainwashed you are, do you?


I wished it were that simple. BUt as you see the final days coming, you will understand that I.M. was trying to tell you how to save America from doom. Instead you chose to follow the people who will lead this country down the path of finality. 9-11 was just the beginning, and I told Satterfield that America was going to get a dose of it's own medicine, and I have told everyone who has posted here the same thing. Yet everytime I have said this, people like you keep trying to tell me that I'm brainwashed. Well 9-11 happened, America was hit with a dose of it's own medicine exactly like I said. So if you want to keep telling me that I'm brainwashed by some liberal spin that has been designed to keep me dependant upon a government that I do not trust, then that's on you. I have never filed for unemployment., welfare, food stamps or anything else.

I see exactly what conservatives are trying to do, and I know that this is NOT good for this country. Bush will win in the short run, but in the long run, we all will lose. And as the Ameircan death toll mounts, let's see how entusiastic you are to continue fighting against an enemy who is tired of being picked on by the United States. Let's see if you really understand exactly how hard God's wrath can be upon a people who for more than 200 years were disobedient, while claiming to be doing Gods will at the same time.

All you conservatives want to do is kill and take away peoples right to stop you from doing so. And then you have the nerve to sit on your ass and tell me that I'm brainwashed. No jeremy, it's you who is brainwashed by conservative spin. And it's you who cannot see just exactly how brainwashed YOU are.

More unproven drivel.


Oh it's proven,and all you have to do is go look at the Department of Health and Humans services website under the classification AFDC and look at the races of those receiving the payments and the numbers of those who did. I have shown you the numners before, and now it's up to you to see them.

Jeremy you want to sit on your baby Huey looking ass and blame minorities for taking away your opportunities. This is conservative spin aimed at dissatisifed white boys like you. And you have eaten it up. This section of NOPC was to talk about the New Gestapo or the Office of Homeland Security. If you want to argue with somebody about race, argue with your dumb ass friends. We've had this argument, and I know that I am right. You cannot tell me that what I have experienced does not happen.

You are a simple minded white boy who is mad because you cannot achieve. Then you project your inability to achieve upon others and try blaming them for yor inadaquacies. It's not my fault that your businesses are failing, it's yours. Somewhere along the line you are not doing something right.

Keep on falling for the lies, and you will sit by your television stunned as another event occurs in this country far worse than 9-11.

The Anti Terrorism bill is what you should be worried about. The bill defines penalties for terrorism, but does not define what constitutes and act of terror. The office of HOmeland Security has been created to defend us from terrorism in this country. And the people working in that offcie, or as part of that offcie can stop and detain anyone at anytime for being a terrorist as defined by the Anti Terrorism bill.

So remember that the Anti Terrorism biull has not defined what an act of terror is. Because you could decide to be part of a protest at the White house, and be detained and charged with terrorism by Ridge, and undergo a Military Tribunal with the Mad Inquisitor John Ashcroft presiding.

All of this has been created by conservatives. They have taken away our freedom, and you want to argue about a race card and liberals.

Just who is the idiot here?

I.M. drives 99 yards and scores another :

TOUCHDOWN!

[IM]

8)

And Jeremy comes back with one of his famous tantrums. Just like a child.

Like these words hs posts are supposed to do something to me.

I know when a man has been defeated in the mental battle. He is defeated when all he can do is attempt to post insults instead of refuting the information he opposes with facts that prove his argument correct.

Just like Jeremy did above.

I.M. throws a bomb to a wide open reciever.

TOUCHDOWN!!

[IM]

Why would I want to jump somebody Jeremy?

Speaking of being brainwashed. A racist statement. And what is racism? A mental belief that has been taught to generations of white boys like yourself, which makes them believe that they are entitled to something because America is their country.

That's brainwashing Jeremy, and you are washed.

That is if you have a brain.

Now since I know nothing, can't read, and all my facts are wrong, why don't you put some facts up which show me to be wrong. And don't be like Les, who pulled his stats from the conservative bullshit unproven fact file. Use stats from the recording agencies which people use to determine policy.

Tell me where terrorism is defined in the Anti Terrorism bill Jeremy. Show me a word by word definition of what constitutes an act of terror as defined by the bill and what is defined as an act of terror by the Office of Homeland Security.

Calling me an idiot, or stupid, or telling me to go jump someone does not proove that I am wrong, not one iota.

All it shows is your ability to have tantrums when someone disagrees with you. And only little children throw tantrums when they do not get their way.

So consider that another compliment.

[IM]

8)

Jeremy,

You are right.

Where we will agree to disagree is that I believe that there is no such thing as a so-called race card, played by blacks to their advantage. If you believe this to be truth, then we must not discount the millions of instances where whites have used race to thier advantage, to include the constitution of the United States.

And yes, Bill CLinton cut out many civil liberties. My problem with all the Clinton bashing is not that he was such a great guy, because he was not, but with the hypocrisy apparent in the republican attack on his morals. We all know that the ring leader Newt Gingrich divorced his first wife on her sick bed. We also know that Newt had numerous affairs with his staff(interns).

We now know that Newt has divorced his second wife Marianne. We also know that Bob Barr has had at least 2 or 3 divorces, which means that he cheated on his wives. So to bring up morals on Clinton created a mirror to use against those who so want to claim moral purity.

The spin used then to attack Clinton then becomes bullshit, because the very same things those attacking Clinton were using they were doing. This to me, renders all their arguments as useless. Then we have a man who has a past history of cocaine use and does not want to talk about it, all the while insinuating that the "liberals" are all about drug use, and all of the things that conservatives have used in their arguments since at least 1990 and even before.

We have a group of people who decide that they want to take a persons fundamental basic right to make choices away from them, simply because they do not agree with the types of choices made. Because in the eyes of these people certain choices to not fit within their moral parameters.

And these people happen to be conservatives. Certainly I do not agree with the act of abortion, but then it becomes my PERSONAL choice not to involve MYSELF with anyone who thinks this is an option. The word of God is written about the act of homosexuality, yet it is not for me to judge those who continue living this lifesyle, but it is my job to make sure that I LOVE my neighbor, regardless of sexual orientation. And it is my job because Jesus says it is.

I could go on and on with what I consider conservative bullshit for you, but the evidence is in front of us. The OHS has been created in a knee jerk reaction to an act which even I, can say was one of the most henious acts ever perpetrated upon humanity. However, we must also realize that this nation and our government regardless of who was in charge, democrat or republican, conservative, liberal or moderate, have done just as much evil to others in this world as those associated with Bin Laden on 9-11.

We must recognize this and stop acting like this nation is a bunch of innocent people who got attacked because Muslims hate us because we are free. If we do not, then this nation will die. It is just that simple. We will die because we will use acts of aggression to counter the acts of aggression which were used against us. The OHS is now here, andit's an entity which takes away our freedom, simply because the act which it was created to defend us against has not been accurately defined. Right now we can protest against this war and everything is O.K. with those in power. But let the American death toll escalate, and let the protests continue, and we wil see Americans hauled off for using the freedoms we are supposed to be granted by the Rule of Law enumerated by our constitution.

This goes far beyond who is playing a race card Jeremy. It is a partrayal of exactly who is and what has caused the problems I face as a black man, and you face as a white man who is not rich, in this nation. And as this thing plays out, you and I will see who has created the division among us in America. And as we do, we should UNITE, and not argue about who is getting what so-called advantage, because neither one of use are.

But the "Fortunate Ones" are. (Creedence Clearwater Revival anyone!) And the Fortunate Ones are not classified by skin color or sex, just by wealth and power.

So lets have this discussion and let's have a good one.

Later.....

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