The Stupidity of Dialogue With Islam

[truelies]

http://www.frontpagemag.com/Articles/ReadArticle.asp?ID=5237

The Stupidity of Dialogue With Islam
By Serge Trifkovic
FrontPageMagazine.com | December 30, 2002


(One in a series of excerpts adapted by Robert Locke from Dr. Serge Trifkovic's new book The Sword of the Prophet: A Politically-Incorrect Guide to Islam)

Of all major religions, Islam is the least amenable to dialogue with other faiths. Among non-Muslims it seeks converts or obedient subjects, not partners in a dialogue. Nevertheless, among some misguided Western social conservatives there exists an a priori desire to forge an alliance of believers against the moral and spiritual decay of a sinful world an "ecumenical jihad," a war of all religions against unbelief:

[Meshuga Mikey]

THIS COMPARES WITH THE STUPIDITY OF A DIALOGUE WIH MOHHAMED OF DUH YUKON~!!!

[Satan]

Take it to the Inferno, Mikey. ::)

[LanceALott]

I am reading a text on Mid East history, and it appears to me that a good and valid religion of Islam was hijacked by Abu Bahr, the first guy who replaced Muhammad when he died.

Same thing happened to the good and valid religion of Christ when Paul hijacked Christianity.

Both perfectly good religions were hijacked and turned into a corrupt political/economic system that wrapped itself in the cloak of religion for the power of religion to get voluntary loyalty and obedience from the subjects.

Now, any "dialogue" with either corrupt religion is like negotiating with the Godfather.

Even so, both religions are failures in modern times; but we all still need that voluntary submisssion to the religious/political/economic system. And unless we want to fight to the last man between the false Christians and the false Muslims, It appears to me we need a synthesis of the two religions going right back to the founders of each, then selecting the good parts of both, and throwing out the crap, to come up with a one world religion where everybody wins.

And if there was no good in either, those religions would have died out long ago, so a synthesis is possible; but not among the lunatics of either religion who use their religion for their own benefit and to crap on everyone else.

[buzaw]

I am reading a text on Mid East history, and it appears to me that a good and valid religion of Islam was hijacked by Abu Bahr, the first guy who replaced Muhammad when he died.

Same thing happened to the good and valid religion of Christ when Paul hijacked Christianity.

LAL, have you ever read a real history of the life of Muhammed the prophet? He founded the religion on terrorism, plunder and slave trade. He killed thousands. After his death, the majority of Muslims wanted to opt out, but the desciples of Muhammed forced them by the sword to remain Islamics or die as heretics. Muhammed's death changed nothing.

How many did Jesus, the apostle Paul and the other desciples kill?? How many did they convert at the point of a sword??

[LanceALott]

buz: LAL, have you ever read a real history of the life of Muhammed the prophet?

LaL; yes, I have read several accounts, one taught buy a Nazarene preacher (Christian). Apparantly you have read somebody's propaganda.

Muhammad was a good man, and he did good things for his people.

Furthermore, after a little over two years after Muhammad's death, it was a "Christian" that murdered one of Muhammad's successors and that ungodly act handed power to evil forces in Islam, just like Paul's "conversion" hijacked Christianity.

Just like Jesus was a good man, so was Muhammad. And, Buz, you are smart enough to figure out both religions would have long ago been thrown on the trash pile of history it there was not some good for their followers in both. Your sin is to believe only "Christians" have a monopoly on good, or to think that all of "Christianity" is good, or worse yet that YOU personally have a monopoly on good.

[buzaw]

LAL, can you document your sorrces? An account of Muhammed's raid of one particular village in which he beheaded all (nearly 1000 males) and took the women and children of the village into slavery to become concubines and for trade to the caravans of slave traders is in my ENCYCLOPEDIA BRITTANICA. After marrying a rich widow, this his how he continued to build his wealth and power and to forcefully advance Islam. I have four comprehensive books on Islam, one of which is fully documented EXCLUSIVELY BY ISLAMIC SOURCES.
Suggested reading:

1. Islam Revealed, by Dr. Anis A Shorrosh
2. Islam Unveiled, The True Desert Storm by Dr. Robert Morey
3. Behind The Veil Unmasking Islam by Abd El Schafi
(Muslim scholars are the sole source of information in this book)
4. The Islam Debate, (Josh McDowell and John Gillcrest vs Ahmed Deedat)

Number three is an excellent one to get as it is solely documented by Islamic sources. It's available from Voice of the Martyrs at a very reasonable price. http://persecution.com is their web site. Just click "books" on the home page and you will find it.

[LanceALott]

Source = "The Middle East" by Benard Lewis, ISBN 0-684-83280-1.

My source is a history book, your's are propaganda.

[LanceALott]

Buzz, here is some more posts of mine about the lunatic fringe of the Muslims. It is from a message board where I've been posting as Lance55 about the JonBenet murder since the books came out by the detective and the parents, about '98. In my new posts I am looking for an Islam connection.

They have the "ransom note" printed on that JBR forum. It starts "...we are a small foriegn faction..." and was signed "Victory! S.B.T.C;" but nobody ever heard of an SBTC. So my radical and offensive idea got sent to the Parking lot, which is like Dante's Inferno. I thought you might like to read some of my ideas, and you should be warned their lunatic fringe does not make the religion of Islam look friendly at all.


Parking Lot
(URL: http://websleuths.com/forum/fb.asp?m=24185)

Websleuths Crime Sleuthing Community: http://websleuths.com/forum/
- Jury Room: http://websleuths.com/forum/?catApp=5
- - Rant & Rave: http://websleuths.com/forum/fb.asp?appid=14


RiverSelah Parking Lot

This one is for when Maxi is away.


Lance55
Super Member




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S.B.T.C. = Stupid Bible Thumping Christian?


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Date: 1/18/03 - 10:44:52 AM




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Lance55 RE: River


Interesting reaction, River, that you a Bible Thumping Christian, would take such strong offense at my possible interpretation of the SBTC.

Perhaps, you should know where I got the idea from?

I am studying a textbook on the Middle East, and it occurred to me that SBTC might be some kind of slam by a Muslim, made at Crhistians, in their modern Crusade/Jihad. A final covert cryptic insult from an Islam tribe, or sect of the Shi'i called the Assassins, which is a small foriegn faction, and perhaps it was because assassination is their principal politial/religious tactic, combined with terrorism.

Perhaps a final act to proclaim to Allah that this assassination of an innocent little girl was an act of Holy Jihad, but an act he could not openly declare to the Christian world at that time, because it did not fit into this strategy for us to know where the insult came from?

So you took offense. Okay, but in my studies, I've concluded that these people just do not like us very much; and they do things to offend us. I think maybe they intended to offend us all with their "insane" act of assassination of a helpless little girl, an act that could only be justified in the mind of the killer as doing the work of Allah, by someone who is a member of the lunatic fringe of some religion, which fits the Assassins.

Let's face a truth, the murder of JBR was an insane act; and for six years we have been trying to see it through sane eyes; and I don't think it can be seen through sane eyes.


_____________________________
RiverSelah Lance

You are a big boy, you can handle the parking lot, I'm sure. I moved your post because OTHERS were offended.

Call me a bible thumper if you'd like. I've been called much worse~ just today in the theater, lol.



Lance55 RE: River, The Dome of the Rock


Here are a couple of inscriptions in the Dome of the Rock that were put there long ago to deliberately more or less declare war against both the Christians and the Jews:

Qur'an 4:171: "...Jesus Christ, the son of Mary, was indeed an apostle of God... Therefore believe in God and his apostles, and do not say 'Three.' Desist, and it will be better for you, for indeed God is one God, exaulted above having a son..."

Sura 112: "He is God, one, eternal. He does not beget, nor is he begotten, and he has no 'peer.'

Qur'an 3:18-19: "...God's religion is Islam... Let whoever disbelieve in the signs of God beware, for God is swift in reconing."

Lance: And the placement of the Dome and these inscruptions i TAKE AS AN OMINIOUS WARNING; the Dome is built on the sight of the Temple, and is considered sacred by both Jewish and Christian religions. It is the very heart of those religions, and Boulder is very near the heart (center) of America.

The Shi'i sect of the Assassins have been around for over a thousand years, and they have assasinated many in the name of Allah. But most of their hits have been against other Muslims that the Shi'i believe have usurped their position.

So some "Christians" were offended by my post, which was a serious idea involving who might have killed JBR; but I understand the offense taken, and that strong reaction might very well have been intentional by whoever put SBTC on that note so that someday we would learn what the religious lunatic meant, perhaps after his anticipated "Victory over the Stupid Bible Thumping Christians."





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Lance55 RE: Parking Lot


There are no other assassins more professional in the stealth and art of silently killing and getting away undetected. None are more feared, not even the CIA.

The death of the target is part of the goal, the second part is to get away undetected, unpunished. That is their proof that Allah has covered their back.


_____________________________

Lance55 RE: Parking Lot



If it was the Assassins, it was more than just a challenge to a bunch of bumbling Boulder cops. It was a challenge to the Christian God, who if He existed had to be offended at this brutal violation of one of America's most protected, and therefore He could not turn a blind eye and let the killers escape.

And look at the day these Assassins chose to descreate, the birth day of Jesus.


<Date: 1/18/03 - 6:51:41 PM




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RiverSelah RE: Parking Lot


Lance, your points are interesting but it's my opinion that one of the Ramseys did it- not one of the older kids either.




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[LanceALott]

The Shi'i

After the death of The Prophet, Muhammad, a man was selected to succeed him as the "rightly guided" leader. One group, the Shi'i, objected strongly to the selection. They wanted a heriditary leader through Muhammad's daughter, Fatima.

And the most radical small foriegn faction of the Shi'i, the Assassins, have been killing the usurpers of the faith ever since and carrying on a Jihad against all the infidels.

[buzaw]

LAL, can you documentably refute this statement?

An account of Muhammed's raid of one particular village in which he beheaded all (nearly 1000 males) and took the women and children of the village into slavery to become concubines and for trade to the caravans of slave traders is in my ENCYCLOPEDIA BRITTANICA.

[LanceALott]

Buzz: An account of Muhammed's raid of one particular village in which he beheaded all (nearly 1000 males) and took the women and children of the village into slavery to become concubines and for trade to the caravans of slave traders is in my ENCYCLOPEDIA BRITTANICA.

LaL: I NEVER HEARD OF THAT CRAP. Are you trying to say Muhammad was as bloody as the Old Testament Jews? Okay, so what if he was? He was a warrior, and in his time a warrior is precisely what the world needed after Paul's "Christianity" had already proven to be a failure..

[buzaw]

Buzz: An account of Muhammed's raid of one particular village in which he beheaded all (nearly 1000 males) and took the women and children of the village into slavery to become concubines and for trade to the caravans of slave traders is in my ENCYCLOPEDIA BRITTANICA.

LaL: I NEVER HEARD OF THAT CRAP. Are you trying to say Muhammad was as bloody as the Old Testament Jews? Okay, so what if he was? He was a warrior, and in his time a warrior is precisely what the world needed after Paul's "Christianity" had already proven to be a failure..


Paul's version of Christianity in no way resembled Vaticanism. Paul's version of Christianity has served this nation so well that it's been the planet's best for 2 centuries.

So now we've established that Mohammed was a bloody terrorist. How many folks did Jesus or any of his desciples kill or persecute??

Btw, Mohammed beheaded the thousand or so AFTER THEY SURRENDERED It took all day. He marched them out to a pit one at a time and beheaded them after which they rolled into the pit. Terrorist is the word, not warrior.

Your source of Islamic history seems to be quite incomplete.

[LanceALott]

Lance: If you had bothered to read all of my posts above, you would find they do not put Islam in a particularly good light. But you only seem interested in doing all the talking, (preaching actually), like you are some kind of "rightly guided" one, just like the damn Shi't.

And I can clearly see you have no interest in truth, only in making your gang of "Christians" look like the good guys, when they are not.

Buzz: Btw, Mohammed beheaded the thousand or so AFTER THEY SURRENDERED

Lance: Yes, probably; just like Michale Spann tried to slaughter all those Afgans AFTER THEY SURRENDERED. Just like the clients of the USA, did with those prisoners after they killed Spann; and I have no doubt those killings were sanctined by the CIA. -- I am afraid you are trying to stand on the moral high ground, Buzz, but a close look shows your "high ground" is a pile of dead bodies and war crimes, just like Muhammad's.

Lance: I am a Vietnam Vet, and I know about Lt Calley, and I know he was only one of many who did the exact same thing you say Muhammad did. And I know the "Christian" hisotry of Paul's "Christianity" is the most bloody of all religions.

Buzz: Your source of Islamic history seems to be quite incomplete.

Lance: And your source of "history" seems to be complete propaganda designed to prop up your own gang of people who could not hold a candle to the real Jesus Christ.

[buzaw]

LAL, when you attempt to somehow judge the apostle Paul's Christianity on the Mai Lai incident, you're way out in left field, in fact, you're clean outa tha park. You gotta get real if this discussion is goin to make any sense.

[LanceALott]

Buzz: LAL, when you attempt to somehow judge the apostle Paul's Christianity on the Mai Lai incident, you're way out in left field, in fact, you're clean outa tha park. You gotta get real if this discussion is goin to make any sense.

LaL: Okay, same back at you. If you are going to judge Islam by some Briticanica propaganda, you are way out in right field.

The truth is, both Paul's "Christianity" and Muhammad's Islam must have some good points or they both would have been trashed long ago. Are you willing to start with this assumption?

[buzaw]

Buzz: LAL, when you attempt to somehow judge the apostle Paul's Christianity on the Mai Lai incident, you're way out in left field, in fact, you're clean outa tha park. You gotta get real if this discussion is goin to make any sense.

LaL: Okay, same back at you. If you are going to judge Islam by some Briticanica propaganda, you are way out in right field.

The truth is, both Paul's "Christianity" and Muhammad's Islam must have some good points or they both would have been trashed long ago. Are you willing to start with this assumption?


All religions have some good in them. Satan's no fool. His cyanide is laced in attractive sweet base. The question is, what is truth. All cannot be true. Allah and Jehovah not one and the same. Both claim to be supreme god. That's what really need be sorted out. The Bible has the prophecies and the Koran has a mishmash of Biblical and retorical stuff in it with no proof of the supernatural.

[Slipped Mickey]

Buzz,

Tell us about the Sufism sect of Islam.

[LanceALott]

Buzz: The question is, what is truth. All cannot be true. Allah and Jehovah not one and the same. Both claim to be supreme god.

Lance: Maybe the Truth is there is neither a Jehovan nor an Allah? In which case we have a whole bunch of people who believe things that are not so, who believe in gods that do not exist, and all meet the legal and clinical definition of insane.

But you are right, the question is what is the Truth? And I am not going to let you thump some dusty old Book, and treat it like it is an Idol, then tell me THE BIBLE IS THE TRUTH! -- When you use your book that way, or when the Muslims use their Qur'an the same way, it is Idolatry.

To show me the Truth, you need something more than an idol made of wood and stone.