How Much Longer Will Jan 1st Be Considered a Holy Day???

For those of you who do not know it - Jan 1st is celebrated as the Feast of The Circumscision.

In other words - it is celebrating that bloody ritual of the cock-cutting of Christ.

But shouldn't it be on the 2nd or 3rd? Wasnt' he cut on the 8th day?

I think the church calendars are really fucked.

More and more people are electing not to have the religious male genital mutilation that the religious want all boys to have. Doctors have determined that it is not a benefit healthwise and it is quickly falling into disuse.

So will the church holiday disapear too?

Has anyone ever stopped to think that this mutilation of tiny male babies was stupid? Now they have, obviously - but did they never think it before? When they gladly handed their tiny boy infants intot he brutal hands of the meat-mincers?

And some of you still do not realize that Christianity is nothing but a cult!!!!

Wake up and see the little foreskins. Crazy!

[truelies]

She is on a roll tonight folks. Probably needs to up the dosage on her meds again.

Come on, everyone - you should know the Holy Days.

Am I the only one here who knows this shit?

And I'm not even a Christian.

http://web.mit.edu/jsolof/www/Sermons/circumcision.html

Only some church calendars have that as a celebration, most don’t observe it. What you describe as a ‘bloody ritual of the cock-cutting of Christ’ only shows your total ignorance to the reason circumcision came about. It was a Covenant between God and Abraham to distinguish his people from the world and it was to be a sign and a remembrance of that covenant. It was done away with when Christ fulfilled the Atonement.

Jews still practice it and that is their business. Parents have the right to choose whether to have their son’s circumcised, no big deal.

Some churches will always observe it and others dismiss it. The main point was the covenant and you know nothing about why a people would make a covenant since you don’t believe in God but I see nothing wrong with it and it’s no more stupid than some of the things you believe in, you simply don’t understand it.

There is no medical information that says circumcision is harmful to the baby.

I've never thought of Jan 1st. as a 'holy' day. Each to their own, right? :)

[Ed Edwards]

CherryBomb: "Wasnt' he cut on the 8th day?"

Yes, He was circumscided on the 8th day.

Born 25 Dec 1BC - day one
day two - 26 Dec 1BC
day three - 27 Dec 1BC
day four - 28 Dec 1BC
day five - 29 Dec 1BC
day six - 30 Dec 1BC
day seven - 31 Dec 1BC
day eight - 01 Jan 1AD.

On the first day of the Christian Era
Jesus became a legitimate person according
to the law of Moses.

Beautiful, isn't it!!!!

[Ed Edwards]

And some of you still do not realize
that Christianity is nothing but a cult!!!!

Define "Christian".
Define "cult".
If you are clever you can define them so you
made a true statement. :)

[truelies]

CherryBomb: "Wasnt' he cut on the 8th day?"

Yes, He was circumscided on the 8th day.

Born 25 Dec 1BC - day one
day two - 26 Dec 1BC
day three - 27 Dec 1BC
day four - 28 Dec 1BC
day five - 29 Dec 1BC
day six - 30 Dec 1BC
day seven - 31 Dec 1BC
day eight - 01 Jan 1AD.

On the first day of the Christian Era
Jesus became a legitimate person according
to the law of Moses.

Beautiful, isn't it!!!!




Thing is its a myth that Jesus was born on December 25.

Uh, just like I thought - a lot of bull.

First of all, Jesus was born around September, not December 25. Having Jesus being born on Dec. 25 is a fanciful notion held by Catholics and The Orthodoxy. But it has nothing to do with Jesus Christ at all. It's purely pagan.


I have to agree. December 25th. was a date for a Pagan holiday, not the actual day Christ was born. Day of the Sun or something like that.

author=lonestar link=board=4;threadid=492;start=0#10665 date=1040164583]
Only some church calendars have that as a celebration, most don’t observe it. What you describe as a ‘bloody ritual of the cock-cutting of Christ’ only shows your total ignorance to the reason circumcision came about. It was a Covenant between God and Abraham to distinguish his people from the world and it was to be a sign and a remembrance of that covenant. It was done away with when Christ fulfilled the Atonement.[/qoute]

I am fully aware of the myth that propagated the horrible practice. But I dismiss it as lunacy. Much like I dismiss the practice of saving only the virgin little girls of your enemy to 'enjoy' later.

Jews still practice it and that is their business. Parents have the right to choose whether to have their son’s circumcised, no big deal.

If they burned the babies on the face with cigarettes would you still consider that 'their business'?

Some churches will always observe it and others dismiss it. The main point was the covenant and you know nothing about why a people would make a covenant since you don’t believe in God but I see nothing wrong with it and it’s no more stupid than some of the things you believe in, you simply don’t understand it.

IT is the sexual mutilation of a child. Sexual abuse of the worst kind. To use religious myths to validate it is beyond belief.

There is no medical information that says circumcision is harmful to the baby.

I've never thought of Jan 1st. as a 'holy' day. Each to their own, right? :)




There are actually more studies done all the time and more and more doctors recommending against it.

But - think about it - why was the body created WITH a foreskin if it was undesirable? Just to cut it off? Have you ever heard the little baby cry when they cut it off with no anesthesia? They scream and scream and scream.

I remember a story of how a lunatic mother put her little infant daughter in a frying pan and how the little girl suffered lasting mental and emotional trauma for years to come.

Now tell me that a tiny infant boy can differentiate excrutiating pain that is forced on him because of a myth and the pain inflicted by a sicko parent frying him a bit.

Sexual mutilation. Pure and simple. As evil as anything in this world. anyone who believes in a god as cruel as one who demands this kind of torture is not quite right in the head. IMHO

Uh, just like I thought - a lot of bull.

First of all, Jesus was born around September, not December 25. Having Jesus being born on Dec. 25 is a fanciful notion held by Catholics and The Orthodoxy. But it has nothing to do with Jesus Christ at all. It's purely pagan.


Pagan yes, so true.

But so much of Christianity is based on pagan myths and beliefs and on the previous beliefs of former Saviors who were the begotten son of God and died and were rescurrected. the entire blood for sin sacrifice was done numerous times before Jesus did it.

But the Feast of the Circumscision is an actual holiday - observed more in other countries than it is here - but if you check Catholic churches in large US cities - there will still be a couple that observe it.

I didn't make it up. Type it in a damn search engine and find out.

[truelies]

[quote author=CherryBomb

Has anyone ever stopped to think that this mutilation of tiny male babies was stupid? Now they have, obviously - but did they never think it before? When they gladly handed their tiny boy infants intot he brutal hands of the meat-mincers?

[/quote]

Did you have your sons circumcised?

CherryBomb: "Wasnt' he cut on the 8th day?"

Yes, He was circumscided on the 8th day.

Born 25 Dec 1BC - day one
day two - 26 Dec 1BC
day three - 27 Dec 1BC
day four - 28 Dec 1BC
day five - 29 Dec 1BC
day six - 30 Dec 1BC
day seven - 31 Dec 1BC
day eight - 01 Jan 1AD.

On the first day of the Christian Era
Jesus became a legitimate person according
to the law of Moses.

Beautiful, isn't it!!!!




Oh so Big Fucking Deal.

Jesus was in the tomb for three days and the Yahoos have him dying on Friday and rising on Sunday.

It's all a bunch of Holy Moly Bull Shit.

[quote author=CherryBomb

Has anyone ever stopped to think that this mutilation of tiny male babies was stupid? Now they have, obviously - but did they never think it before? When they gladly handed their tiny boy infants intot he brutal hands of the meat-mincers?



Yes and I regret it to this day.

I was so fucking ignorant. Someone should have slapped me up-side the head and knocked some fucking sense into me.



Did you have your sons circumcised?
[/quote]

You're confusing Catholicism with Christianity. Two different things.

One believes the Bible the other believes in wild eyed traditions that have no basis in scripture.

It's embarassing, I know, but that's what you deal with when you're talking to someone who knows very little about what Christianity really is.


Okay, so enlighten me...which is which?

They both seem pretty lame to me. And I would be willing to bet that I know the bible better than most here.

The assholes you speakof are those Catholics I keep warning people about.

He would have had to die on Thursday so as to not break the Sabbath.


Thales.

I just can not take you seriously when you are flying that Avatar.

All I can do is look at it and giggle.

BTW - to me - they are all Christians - I see very little difference - I simply characterise them as either fundie or non-fundie. Most Catholics are non's although I have seen some that are fundies.

Someone should have slapped me up-side the head and knocked some fucking sense into me.


I've got first dibs on this!!!!


Hey! No crowding. There are many in line ahead of you. ;D ;D

Cherry,

That's because of two things:

1. You're not saved, so you wouldn't have the Holy Spirit to enlighten you on this.

2. Maybe you don't know enough scripture like you say you do.

This all sounds funny coming from me, but like I said, I'm a horrible Christian and nobody should look at me as a role model for behaviour.


I dont have to be saved, Thales, my Jewish blood says that I am 'chosen' so I get to do and say whatever the Hell I please and I get to wait until the last minute and then decide to conform.

That is - if you believe that sort of thing. ;D

author=lonestar link=board=4;threadid=492;start=0#10665 date=1040164583]
Only some church calendars have that as a celebration, most don’t observe it. What you describe as a ‘bloody ritual of the cock-cutting of Christ’ only shows your total ignorance to the reason circumcision came about. It was a Covenant between God and Abraham to distinguish his people from the world and it was to be a sign and a remembrance of that covenant. It was done away with when Christ fulfilled the Atonement.[/qoute]

I am fully aware of the myth that propagated the horrible practice. But I dismiss it as lunacy. Much like I dismiss the practice of saving only the virgin little girls of your enemy to 'enjoy' later.

Jews still practice it and that is their business. Parents have the right to choose whether to have their son’s circumcised, no big deal.

If they burned the babies on the face with cigarettes would you still consider that 'their business'?

Some churches will always observe it and others dismiss it. The main point was the covenant and you know nothing about why a people would make a covenant since you don’t believe in God but I see nothing wrong with it and it’s no more stupid than some of the things you believe in, you simply don’t understand it.

IT is the sexual mutilation of a child. Sexual abuse of the worst kind. To use religious myths to validate it is beyond belief.

There is no medical information that says circumcision is harmful to the baby.

I've never thought of Jan 1st. as a 'holy' day. Each to their own, right? :)




There are actually more studies done all the time and more and more doctors recommending against it.

But - think about it - why was the body created WITH a foreskin if it was undesirable? Just to cut it off? Have you ever heard the little baby cry when they cut it off with no anesthesia? They scream and scream and scream.

I remember a story of how a lunatic mother put her little infant daughter in a frying pan and how the little girl suffered lasting mental and emotional trauma for years to come.

Now tell me that a tiny infant boy can differentiate excrutiating pain that is forced on him because of a myth and the pain inflicted by a sicko parent frying him a bit.

Sexual mutilation. Pure and simple. As evil as anything in this world. anyone who believes in a god as cruel as one who demands this kind of torture is not quite right in the head. IMHO


That's your right, think what you want. It is not torture and it is not 'sexual mutilation'. You just spend your time looking for anything and everything to discredit the bible, God, faith and those who believe in it. You won't change any minds around here and you've already raised my eyebrows and you might get some pats on the back but you won't change anybody's mind.

What went on 4,000 years ago and what goes on in the medical profession today are two different stories.

CherryBomb: "Wasnt' he cut on the 8th day?"

Yes, He was circumscided on the 8th day.

Born 25 Dec 1BC - day one
day two - 26 Dec 1BC
day three - 27 Dec 1BC
day four - 28 Dec 1BC
day five - 29 Dec 1BC
day six - 30 Dec 1BC
day seven - 31 Dec 1BC
day eight - 01 Jan 1AD.

On the first day of the Christian Era
Jesus became a legitimate person according
to the law of Moses.

Beautiful, isn't it!!!!




Oh so Big Fucking Deal.

Jesus was in the tomb for three days and the Yahoos have him dying on Friday and rising on Sunday.

It's all a bunch of Holy Moly Bull Shit.


Boy you are wound up tonight. Why don't you again try to explain to us ignorant fools here what you actually believe in then we can have some fun with you.

[Meshuga Mikey]

I remember a story of how a lunatic mother put her little infant daughter in a frying pan and how the little girl suffered lasting mental and emotional trauma for years to come.



That sounds like another version of the urban legend about the hippie girl babysitter who put the baby in the oven while tripping on acid because she thought it was a turkey.


The EARLY CHURCH co-opted a pagan Festival to FEED the MASSES and perhaps get them to accept Christianity is some regard and thus we have Christmas In December~!

Cherry is a mongrel pinwheel KNOW NOTHING absurdist DITZ~!!!

[Meshuga Mikey]

[quote author=lonestar
Boy you are wound up tonight. Why don't you again try to explain to us ignorant fools here what you actually believe in then we can have some fun with you.
[/quote]

DEC. 19 th 19 10 GMT---- FULL MOON,...this MAY help our understanding of this Cherry Blums pathetic condition~!!!

[quote author=lonestar
Boy you are wound up tonight. Why don't you again try to explain to us ignorant fools here what you actually believe in then we can have some fun with you.


DEC. 19 th 19 10 GMT---- FULL MOON,...this MAY help our understanding of this Cherry Blums pathetic condition~!!!
[/quote]

Full moon, of course. ;D

[Ed Edwards]

Trulies: "Thing is its a myth that Jesus
was born on December 25."

I think it is correct, Jesus was born 25 Dec 0001BC
and circumscized on 01 Jan 0001AD.

Thales: "It's purely pagan."

One person's pagan is another person's orthodoxy.

Lonestar: "December 25th. was a date for a Pagan holiday, not the actual day Christ was born. "

I think Jesus was born 25 Dec 0001BC.
Who will be the first to talk about
sheepherders out in the cold. Come on,
it is 68-degrees right now
in Oklahoma at the 35th parallel,
about the same as Jerusalem.
Anyway, were were the Shephers to keep their sheep,
not like there was a sheep motel nearby :)

Thales: "You're confusing Catholicism with Christianity. Two different things."

Amen, Brother Thales -- Preach it!

CherryBomb: "Did you have your sons circumcised?"

Yes, on the 8th day.
So he would look like me.
He is 20 now.
Here is a picture of his green hair :)

http://eded.tripod.com/edmain.html

[wendy]

Ed, you have a nice looking family. Why does your son have green hair?

[Ed Edwards]

I don't know Wendya why my son has
green hair. I guess he got tired of the blue :)

And thank you for the compliments.

[quote author=lonestar
Boy you are wound up tonight. Why don't you again try to explain to us ignorant fools here what you actually believe in then we can have some fun with you.


DEC. 19 th 19 10 GMT---- FULL MOON,...this MAY help our understanding of this Cherry Blums pathetic condition~!!!
[/quote]

Are you saying I am a vampire?

How rude. Draco used to say shit like that about me. That I was a huntress - a predator. I 'll have you know that's not true.

Now throw me a fuckin Christian.

Boy you are wound up tonight. Why don't you again try to explain to us ignorant fools here what you actually believe in then we can have some fun with you.


Okay. I believe the world is an illusion.

I believe there is a God and he is embarrassed by the crap the bible says about him.

I believe that there is no evil.

I believe there is no sin.

I believe there is no death.

There you go - have fun.

Okay. I believe the world is an illusion.

I believe there is a God and he is embarrassed by the crap the bible says about him.

I believe that there is no evil.

I believe there is no sin.

I believe there is no death.

There you go - have fun.


A-fucking-men...or whatever, of course.

You understand!

I knew you did. :)

Boy you are wound up tonight. Why don't you again try to explain to us ignorant fools here what you actually believe in then we can have some fun with you.


Okay. I believe the world is an illusion.

I believe there is a God and he is embarrassed by the crap the bible says about him.

I believe that there is no evil.

I believe there is no sin.

I believe there is no death.

There you go - have fun.


So what does it mean?

lonestar,

It is really very simple. It means exactly what I posted. badnews understands, as do some others.

[Ed Edwards]

CherryBomb: "Okay. I believe the world is an illusion."

You are in for a REAL eyeopener :)

Interestingly enough, there is a world/dimension/plane
more real than this one. Recommend you make
plans to go there.

\0/ \0/ JESUS IS #1 ! \0/ \0/
Ed's Uplifting Page
\0/ \0/ MARANATHA! \0/ \0/

Edward, did I ever tell you your sig reminds me of some homosexual with his legs spread and his testicles on either side of his thighs?

Just a thought.

I don't know what you're "uplifting," but I'd work on the ascii art.

Need help?

:)

CherryBomb: "Okay. I believe the world is an illusion."

You are in for a REAL eyeopener :)

Interestingly enough, there is a world/dimension/plane
more real than this one. Recommend you make
plans to go there.


You have no proof of that, Ed. You only have myths and legends. It may be YOU that is in for the eyeopener. :o

[Descartes]

Sorry, circumcision isn't just for christians any more.


What has been the medical view of circumcision?

In 1975 the American Academy of Pediatrics (AAP) stated in no uncertain terms that "there is no absolute medical indication for routine circumcision of the newborn." And in 1983 the AAP and the American College of Obstetricians and Gynecologists (ACOG) restated this position.

What is now the medical view of circumcision?

Evidence has emerged indicating there are medical benefits from circumcision. The incidence of urinary tract infections in male infants appears to be reduced when circumcision is done in the newborn period. There also looks to be a relationship between circumcision and sexually transmitted diseases and, in turn, there is a relationship between sexually transmitted diseases and cancer of both the cervix and penis.[/sup]

http://www.focusoncancer.com/script/main/art.asp?articlekey=7685&rd=1

[Ed Edwards]

CherryBomb: "You have no proof of that, Ed.
You only have myths and legends."

I have much more than myths and legends.
I have hope.

CherryBomb: "It may be YOU that is in for the eyeopener."

I doubt it. If you are wrong, i inherit
eternal life. If I am wrong i will die someday
and stay dead and will not be aware of anything.
And my eyes will then be closed.

Badnews: "Edward, did I ever tell you your sig
reminds me of some homosexual with his legs
spread and his testicles on either side of his thighs?"

Thank you for the bad news Badnews :)
Recommend you tell your shrink, not me.

Badnews: "I don't know what you're "uplifting," but I'd work on the ascii art.
Need help?"

I'm listening. I read the posts in topics i
post to.

[Slipped Mickey]

You're confusing Catholicism with Christianity. Two different things.

The early Christian Church was split into two groups Literalists and Gnostics. Through religious politics and a scramble for control the Literalists won. The Literalists soon became the Roman Catholics. The Literalists wrote the history and destroyed much of what the Gnostics believed. For a great while we only had bit and pieces. The Nag Hammadi changed all that. There were two groups of thought in the early days.

Thales is telling us that there was a third group. Please explain Thales what the third group was and how it came to be.

[Slipped Mickey]

Look I don't want to be ugly about this but there's a great deal of myth involved here. It started with the Greeks and the similarities between the early Pagan Mysteries and Christianity is something that cannot be ignored. The hero's journey, noble death, salvation through faith, the holy days, the ceremonies, the last supper, 12 disciples, the fish symbol, virgin birth, on and on. It all existed in tradition BEFORE Christianity.

Young master Thales makes the bold statement regarding Christianity and Catholicism not being the same thing. Which Pagan beliefs separate the two groups?

You're confusing Catholicism with Christianity. Two different things.

The early Christian Church was split into two groups Literalists and Gnostics. Through religious politics and a scramble for control the Literalists won. The Literalists soon became the Roman Catholics. The Literalists wrote the history and destroyed much of what the Gnostics believed. For a great while we only had bit and pieces. The Nag Hammadi changed all that. There were two groups of thought in the early days.

Thales is telling us that there was a third group. Please explain Thales what the third group was and how it came to be.



There were many groups shortly after Christ. Everywhere there was a church there were different interpretations of what Christ said or meant. Paul spent most of his time trying to put down heresies and he was mainly involved with the Gentiles. The church at Jerusalem was one main branch and the church in Africa was another. Christ had 12 Apostles and 8 or 9 of them we have no record of their preaching and teachings so no doubt there were more. The fact is there was a lot of dissention going on and many wolves had gotten into the pack and the bible refers to them as ‘many antichrists’. It was Constantine and the bringing together of the Roman Empire with the Gentile church that created modern day Christianity and no matter what buzzboy says every Protestant church is a break off of the Roman Catholic Church. Either the Catholic Church is the true church of Christ or it isn’t. Either way the Protestants don’t have a leg to stand on since they exist as break off’s of the Catholic Church. What ever Christ began in Jerusalem soon fell apart after about 300 years and what you have today is nothing more than a man-made religion created out of a few scraps of paper that was left over from the glory days when inspired men walked the earth.

[BrandonL]

Cherry, I had my son circumcised, and if I had another son-I'd do the same thing. It was a personal decision, as I'm not religious (as you know).

(Too much info alert)
I am-and I've had no ill effects from it. I'm not "emotionally scarred" in any way.
(end too much info alert)

Can you tell us the disadvantages, that you know of, to being circumcised? ASIDE from the initial procedure. There are benefits to both-but it's not the way you portray it.

brandon,

I, too, had my boys circumcused - but I was stupid to do it. The medical community has really tip-toed around this issue because of the fear of stepping on religious toes.

New studies indicate that it is very questionable whether or not the surgery has any benefit to the baby. Studies have been on adult males who were circumcised and the procedure resulted in sexual losses.

http://www.icgi.org/Downloads/Loss.htm

But, we also start to get into some human rights issues. Why is a procedure (often done without anesthesia) that requires the loss of a body part (foreskin) allowed without the victims approval? What kind of warped thinking is that?

The Genital Mutilation Law was passed in 93 that protects females from circumcision - even though some African religions demanded it as a "right". But, somehow, the medical community has been lax in enforcing the same rights for little boys. And why, you ask? Simple - because the religious myths of the African people are largely outnumbered in the US by the religious myths of the Judeao-Christians element.

Every person should have the right to life, liberty, and the security of their own person. It is an International Law and yet it is disregarded in the face of superstition. Circumcision is a needless act of violence performed upon a resisting and nonconsenting newborn
infant, or child.

It is a ridiculous and abusive practice that only now the medical community is starting to address. But the pressure from the religious community is fierce. They cling to their rituals as if they were life-boats.

Only education of the ignorance will bring the truth of this barbaric practice to a halt. If an adult male wants to be circumcised - that is his choice.

America has laws to protect children from most forms of abuse - but not this one - yet. It will change, however, as more and more people realise the stupidity behind the practice, IMO. Even now - Jewish families are beginging to realise that it is not necessary and that cutting the flesh from their newborn - for a superstition is probably pretty ignorant.

http://www.noharmm.org/jewhouseholds.htm

But we have a long ways to go - before some folks see the harm their religious beliefs really causes. IMO

[truelies]

CB surely you are aware that there is no similarity between male circumcision which has positive health effects including fewer by far urinary tract infections & much less genital cancer and so called female circumcision which is pure multilation.

The positive health effects you speak of are quickly being denounced by medical professionals. There is, to be fair, a potential benefit to a sexual partner of the male in later years.

Girls have to observe stricter hygiene than males. It is not too difficult to teach a boy to wash himself.

But even if the circumcision DOES benefit a partner down the road - is that a good enough reason to perform the surgery.

The link DEscartes posted is almost 20 years old. New medical thought is changing drastically.

[truelies]

I would have to say that there is enough gain to justify the short term discomfort. No man has any real memory of getting snipped when he was two/three weeks old. On the otherhand there are not infrequent cases of men who were not snipped as babies but ended up needing it at around age 40. I know 2 such and they both have THAT memory seared in their brains.

The positive health effects you speak of are quickly being denounced by medical professionals. There is, to be fair, a potential benefit to a sexual partner of the male in later years.

Girls have to observe stricter hygiene than males. It is not too difficult to teach a boy to wash himself.

But even if the circumcision DOES benefit a partner down the road - is that a good enough reason to perform the surgery.

The link DEscartes posted is almost 20 years old. New medical thought is changing drastically.



Do you have something to back up your opinions here. You use words like 'drastically' and 'being denounced' as if today's headlines will denounce circumcision as a evil practice.

I already posted the links to the current studies by the medical community and the organisations that have been set up to denounce circumcision as child abuse.

My point is WHY do people have to be told. It is easy to understand that it is wrong.

I already posted the links to the current studies by the medical community and the organisations that have been set up to denounce circumcision as child abuse.

My point is WHY do people have to be told. It is easy to understand that it is wrong.


5 out of 7 doctors recommend..... With the number of doctors out there it's no surprise some would be aganist it. truelies is right about what he said, I was circumcised myself and I don't remember it at all and it certainly didn't curb my sexual enjoyments in the least. It should be and always should be the choice of the parents.

I already posted the links to the current studies by the medical community and the organisations that have been set up to denounce circumcision as child abuse.

My point is WHY do people have to be told. It is easy to understand that it is wrong.


5 out of 7 doctors recommend..... With the number of doctors out there it's no surprise some would be aganist it. truelies is right about what he said, I was circumcised myself and I don't remember it at all and it certainly didn't curb my sexual enjoyments in the least. It should be and always should be the choice of the parents.


You have no idea whether you would have had less emotional turmoil in your life had you not been circumcised.

The study I posted on men who electively chose circumcision shows evidence of loss of sexual function. How many men today have sexual problems and never knew it was attributed to circumcision.

I stand by the fact that it is utterly horrible and child abuse of the worse kind. I think you will see a large change in opinion coming now that folks are learning to judge acts that before they only took for granted.

I already posted the links to the current studies by the medical community and the organisations that have been set up to denounce circumcision as child abuse.

My point is WHY do people have to be told. It is easy to understand that it is wrong.


5 out of 7 doctors recommend..... With the number of doctors out there it's no surprise some would be aganist it. truelies is right about what he said, I was circumcised myself and I don't remember it at all and it certainly didn't curb my sexual enjoyments in the least. It should be and always should be the choice of the parents.


You have no idea whether you would have had less emotional turmoil in your life had you not been circumcised.

The study I posted on men who electively chose circumcision shows evidence of loss of sexual function. How many men today have sexual problems and never knew it was attributed to circumcision.

I stand by the fact that it is utterly horrible and child abuse of the worse kind. I think you will see a large change in opinion coming now that folks are learning to judge acts that before they only took for granted.




Most sexual problems for men come from a cold wife or partner, not because their foreskin is missing. ;D

[BrandonL]

I would have to say that there is enough gain to justify the short term discomfort. No man has any real memory of getting snipped when he was two/three weeks old. On the otherhand there are not infrequent cases of men who were not snipped as babies but ended up needing it at around age 40. I know 2 such and they both have THAT memory seared in their brains.

This is very, very, very true. I know of one myself. He could not walk for a week-swelled up. This is common from what I hear, since it's a much more involved procedure when they are older.

Babies generally get it done the day after they are born, and it heals in a couple of days, max.

Jewish babies, however, get it done a little later-but it's still faster healing.

[BrandonL]

Since I, on NM, posted a thread about childbirth and was quickly pounced upon by women-how can you, Cherry know anything about it, not having a penis yourself?

8)

[truelies]

[quote author=CherryBomb

I stand by the fact that it is utterly horrible and child abuse of the worse kind. I think you will see a large change in opinion coming now that folks are learning to judge acts that before they only took for granted.


[/quote]

Ok lets cut to the chase- You have made an explicit claim that circumcising one's son is at best an act of ignorance and if done in possession of professional medical knowledge an act of abuse. Are you saying that the proceedure should be made illegal? Should Doctors be subject to damage claims for proceedures done 20/30 years ago?

Since I, on NM, posted a thread about childbirth and was quickly pounced upon by women-how can you, Cherry know anything about it, not having a penis yourself?

8)


I dont remember your childbirth thread but - as a mom - we have to clean the little penises until YOU are able to clean them yourself. And , yes, your very own mother washed and dried your little Johnson - so dont' dis moms!

[quote author=CherryBomb

I stand by the fact that it is utterly horrible and child abuse of the worse kind. I think you will see a large change in opinion coming now that folks are learning to judge acts that before they only took for granted.




Ok lets cut to the chase- You have made an explicit claim that circumcising one's son is at best an act of ignorance and if done in possession of professional medical knowledge an act of abuse. Are you saying that the proceedure should be made illegal? Should Doctors be subject to damage claims for proceedures done 20/30 years ago?
[/quote]

I think it will eventually be illegal. But, no, I do not favor suing the doctors. Some now refuse to do it and others discourage it, because they were coerced by religious biases.

There really is no difference between the circumcision of females in African and Indoneasian religions and the circumsion of males in Judeao Christian religions. The female procedure lessens the feeling of sex for females leading to them being less promiscious. Something some cultures view as a benifit.

[BrandonL]

I dont remember your childbirth thread but - as a mom - we have to clean the little penises until YOU are able to clean them yourself. And , yes, your very own mother washed and dried your little Johnson - so dont' dis moms!

it was a thread about doctors being too quick to intercede and administer drugs...

I know my mom had to clean it-what I am saying is that, since you don't have one, how can you comment on a subject that involves men's penises? To understand what's it like with one-you have to have one. You don't know (and there's NO way to measure if it is) that sexual disfunction is really the result of the c. or if the man woulda have gotten it anyways. You can't quite comprehed what it would feel like to have one later in life, or what it actually feels like with or without one.

Do you remember your PKU test? Your billirubin test? Do you remember chiuldbirth (imho a MUCH more painful procedure for the baby). The answer is no.

[BrandonL]

There really is no difference between the circumcision of females in African and Indoneasian religions and the circumsion of males in Judeao Christian religions. The female procedure lessens the feeling of sex for females leading to them being less promiscious. Something some cultures view as a benifit.

Are you saying that circumcision of males lessens sexual feeling? How can you possibly measure that?

Do you have the guy have sex with a hot chick, snip him, then he has sex again when it heals and he rates them? How subjective!!

[truelies]

[quote author=CherryBomb

There really is no difference between the circumcision of females in African and Indoneasian religions and the circumsion of males in Judeao Christian religions. The female procedure lessens the feeling of sex for females leading to them being less promiscious. Something some cultures view as a benifit.

[/quote]

In the Jewish religion the purpose of circumcision was NOT to lessen sexual pleasure. It was-

a) an act of obedience marking the boy/man as God's property

b) an inducement not to cut & run in battle, because if run down later there would be no way to pass yourself off as a non-Jew.

[Meshuga Mikey]

an inducement not to
cut & run in battle, because if run down later there would be no way to pass yourself off as a non-Jew.


http://people.delphiforums.com/artcruncher/THERITIS.gif

[quote author=truelies
[/quote][b]

In the Jewish religion the purpose of circumcision was NOT to lessen sexual pleasure. It was-

a) an act of obedience marking the boy/man as God's property

b) an inducement not to cut & run in battle, because if run down later there would be no way to pass yourself off as a non-Jew.
[/b

Well, I don't think those reasons are really important in today's world, but I believe you that they were probably why it started.

With today's hygiene there is no reason to hurt the little guys anymore.

Why don't you big brave men come over here and I will cut off a teeny little bit of your penis and let's see how YOU like it!!!]

[Slipped Mickey]

Slipped,

You're assuming that your knowledge of church history is all there is and whatever you said is the truth, but you paint yourself into a corner when you assume that this is all there is.

That's YOUR assumption. I am assuming nothing.


I think what lonestar said is pretty much right.


Which is now to say that you do recognize the Roman Catholic Church as a Christian faith? That is precisely part what of what lonestar said.


Also, you should go and read more than just a few books on this because you can learn alot if you read from both sides of this issue. You will never learn the whole truth from reading just one's side of the story.

I do and I have. And what books are you reading that provide you with a more well rounded perspective of Christianity? Buzz once told me reading books other than the Bible was not necessary for perspective on Christianity. You are saying more than the Bible is necessary for Christians.

Hey. this is my spiffy-doodly weinie-cutting thread, guys. Lets talk about what Lorena Bobbitt did - ouch! ;D

[truelies]

Been there done that many years ago. The positive effects of a snip & clip ALL come from the first proceedure so I will have to pass on your kind offer Ms Bobbit.

Cherry,

Slipped addressed me and I responded. Is something wrong with that? ???

But FWIW, I'd be happy to shut up. ;D


Dont shut up. I hijack threads all the time.

I am just trying to get it back to weinie-whacking. ;D

[Slipped Mickey]

<Mickey with his knees together, hands on his nuts, trying to keep his ass between his legs>

Yes ma'am, Miss Cherrybomb, ma'am. We sure is sorry an' you won't be ketching us messin' wiff yo' subjec' agin ma'am. You can beleee dat shit.

[Ed Edwards]

Lonestar: "What ever Christ began in Jerusalem
soon fell apart after about 300 years and what
you have today is nothing more than a man-made
religion created out of a few scraps of paper
that was left over from the glory days
when inspired men walked the earth."

Which Protestant Christianity has been trying
to restore lo these last 400 years.

Your short History of Christianity also
missed two groups that were larger than
the Roman Catholic Church at times:
the Eastern Orthodox Churches and the
Nestorian Churches

Truelies: "no similarity between male circumcision which has positive health effects including fewer by far urinary tract infections & much less genital cancer and so called female circumcision which is pure multilation."

Amen, Truelies!

CherryBomb: "You have no idea whether you would
have had less emotional turmoil in your
life had you not been circumcised. "

Your argument is out of futility.
You have no idea he might have LESS emotional turmoil
in his life having been circumcised.
There is no way to know either way. Therefore
yours is a non-argument.

CherryBomb: "The female procedure lessens the feeling
of sex for females leading to them being less
promiscious. Something some cultures view
as a benifit."

"Lessens"? It totally eleminates.
You are comparing firecrackers and atomic bombs here.